Threat Lists and List of Tiers

That's why I got people to do ubers for me.

Spoiler

Spoiler

[/HIDE]

Ubers Threatlist so far: Refer to my post #90

Spoiler

Aegislash:
Amoonguss:
Arceus:

Spoiler

Arceus
Arceus-Bug:
Arceus-Dark:
Arceus-Dragon:
Arceus-Electric:
Arceus-Fairy:
Arceus-Fighting:
Arceus-Fire:
Arceus-Flying:
Arceus-Ghost:
Arceus-Grass:
Arceus-Ground:
Arceus-Ice:
Arceus-Poison:
Arceus-Psychic:
Arceus-Rock:
Arceus-Steel:
Arceus-Water:

Spoiler

Blaziken:
Blissey:
Bronzong:
Chansey:
Clefable:
Darkrai:
Deoxys-A:
Deoxys-D:
Deoxys-S:
Dialga:
Ditto:
Ferrothorn:
Forretress:
Garchomp:
Gastrodon:
Genesect:
Gengar:
Giratina:
Giratina-O:
Gliscor:
Groudon:
Gyarados:
Heatran:
Hippowdon:
Ho-Oh:
Jirachi:
Kangaskhan:
Klefki:
Kyogre:
Kyurem-W:
Landorus-T:
Lucario:
Lugia:
Mewtwo:
Mewtwo-X:
Mewtwo-Y:
Palkia:
Rayquaza:
Reshiram:
Scizor:
Scolipede:
Shaymin-S:
Shedinja:
Skarmory:
Smeargle:
Sylveon:
Terrakion:
Thundurus:
Wobbuffet:
Xerneas:
Yveltal:
Zekrom:
[/hide]

 

I edited both lists:
OU: http://pastebin.com/tecWu8W3
Ubers: http://pastebin.com/VvY92XjR

Oh, I thought to add the sets too, but it wasn't in the others lists, so...

 

I'd add for Ubers:
-Xatu: Defog it a thing now, but it can still prevent your opponent from using entry hazards, since Deo-S often lacks Dark Pulse.
-Metagross: Very good Xerneas counter, especially with Assault Vest.
-Tyranitar: Still a great special wall or good sweeper with its mega stone.
-Kyurem-B: Not many fairys as counter in this tier, 170 base Atk.

 

WHY DO PEOPLE SPELL BASED AMOONGUSS WRONG IT IRKS ME TO NO END DO YOU HEAR ME PEOPLE?

Autism aside, I've got a few suggestions on my own.
First things first, anyone can kinda mention the main threats, so I'll mostly be working to write on the Niches of the tier. This means that I freely admit that they are not the strongest threats there are. However, they are just barely usable to put people off guard/play heavy prediction based matches via unpredictability/small niches like Gastro.

Landorus-I is better than one may expect, as it allows unpredictability in LO physical/special, and a decent enough phys bulk to tank at least one Espeed from an unboosted Ekiller when acting as a Rock Polish user. May try that there. 101 speed is also usable in the tier as a LO SD wallbreaker/LO Special attacker as it can outpace many 90~100s that reside in the tier.

As Slayer said, Xatu. Supporting Xatu to the max :)

I'd definately add Victini in there. Trick Room is a viable strategy in Ubers, and it does a good job of crushing through various offensive teams that exist on the ladder. Even Stall has troubles as it gets a rather easy switch on the likes of Ferro/Forry, ignores Gira-A due to its immunity to Will-o-Wisp, and breaks down Ho-oh/Groudon/Palkia core with proper predictions + a Life Orb.
V for Victory~

Thanks to Belly Drum and new physical Fairy STAB, Azumarill is definitely a choice. A gimmick to be sure, but a very usable one. Band can pull off extremely high damages, and no longer gets walled by any notable thing in Ubers. It's niche is that it becomes unwallable in Rain(Kyogre exists everywhere btw even with the rain nerf), as Ferrothorn/Gastro/Dialga, the opponent's common Kyogre counter/tanks, cannot switch in on Azu. Ho-oh, a fairly common mon used in Ubers to get rid of pesky Fairies, is completely crushed by Azu.

Charizard X/Y is now completely viable as a teammate in XY Ubers.
X can act as a powerful wallbreaker alongside Ho-oh, as it can quickly spam DD'd Outrage on Ho-oh's main counters such as Tyranitar and Arc-Rock. Arc-Rock will be taking a severe hit if it swapped on a DD, allowing others to finish it off, or prevent it from recovering ever again. Much better than Reshiram imo.

Y has a niche. Sunny day/Solarbeam/FireBlast/Filler can wreck a lot of unprepared teams with its firepower. Predict a Kyogre switch-in with Sunny day, and nuke others with its Drought and Fire moves. Again, heavily prediction reliant, but it is definitely one of the harder mons to wall if you lack a specific pink blob.

I'll add on to this list as I find more fun viable things to use in Ubers.

Are we going to do a simple analysis+ what counters what for the tier? I'd love to help if such a thing happens.

 

I dont think that Zard-X (not 100% sure about Y) is used in any serious ubers team.

 

Not usually at least, but I guess if you give it the right support like Ramiel was saying it could work. I'd need to test it (and Zard Y too) to see if it's good. As for Victini, I'm not sure. Its niche is sooooo tiny compared to other mons in that list, and from my experience, Trick Room isn't nearly as good as you're making it out to be. I haven't seen an Azumarill in my life so I'm kinda iffy on that too, but I guess I'll try it out too. The main problem I have with including these mons is that you're never ever going to rate a team and say "well you're really Azumarill weak so you should change that and that and that", especially when they are not used at all by a regular ladder player.

 

Assuming this is the OU threat list, the following pokemon need to be added: Keldeo, Starmie, Scolipede, Quagsire, Salamence, Jolteon, Jellicent, Noivern, Chesnaught, Amoonguss, Blastoise (eh), Heracross, Gastrodon, Hippowdon, Reuniclus, Magnezone, Kingdra, Staraptor (eh), Suicune (eh), Metagross, Politoed, Haxorus, Roserade (eh), Aggron (eh), Dugtrio (eh), Tornadus(-T), and Ninetales. The ones that have (eh) next to them are debatable. If you need any clarification or justification, just ask.

 

Add Tyranitar (huge bulk, I've seen some rest sleep talk sets with mega etc...), pretty sure Xatu cannot Defog without losing its niche that's Magic Bounce (in the tb Defog is a gen 4 TM and MBounce is a gen 5/6 (?) ability), Deo D is slower than the most common Defogger (Arceus) and Darkai and Yveltal just love to face this guy, it still has Taunt but it loses all his hazards at least once so Idk if it should be listed there, Forretress is used way less than past gen and for a reason, Defog>>>>RSpin (spinning was hard before anyway) its only niche is setting those 3 hazards, it loses to Xerneas if Sturdy is broken, I'd use a Scolipede (really underrated poke right here) for hazards and an Arceus for Defog over it

EDIT: If Xatu can run Defog with Magic Bounce (I doubt) feel free to ignore what I said

EDIT2: Never seen an Azumarill, and Victini is meh since Sun doesn't stay forever and Idk how you are supposed to use this thing like send Groudon and then what? send Victini into ???

 

I'm agreeing with ZoroDark on Victini. In practice it's ok enough on the ladder but in serious matches very few run trick room and the few that do only really run trick room on palkia, bronzong, maybe an arceus form, and it's highly unlikely to be run on anything else.

Tyranitar deserves to be in there, it's still a great anti-lead, although I can say nothing of the effect of its mega.
Azumarill/Xatu/Forretress/Deo-D lol. I guess if they're in threat lists they're way down at the bottom, I've not seen a single one used seriously.
Scolipede deserves a spot, it's a great lead at both baton passing boosts and setting up hazards; it is underrated by some.
Zard X and Y are both legitimate, I think on smogon's ubers viability thread donkey and I think trick room were both praising their capabilities. A really rare sight and I haven't seen them but I hear they're really very good; I think shrang is going to test zard X soon as well.
Metagross is awful. Set up bait for a lot of mons, there are so many better xerneas checks and counters that don't do that. Please don't use it.
PLEASE take shedinja off the list, I know fixed made it work, but seriously in such a status heavy meta it's awful [I even tried to write the smogon analysis for it and got QC 3/3 rejected]
Add Quagsire to the Ubers list, it is a legitimate ekiller counter with unaware. I don't remember what else it does but it puts in work I've heard.
And tbh I'd probably go with most of what ZoroDark is saying in here about ubers, it's making more sense than what slayer/ramiel seem to be saying, overall. Ofc though it's all open for discussion, but these are my two cents.

 

Shitty phone, b_s

I was thinking of making a specific moveset threatlist under each pokemon as well, but its not my priority atm. We should get all of the viable pokemon into the threatlist then make an analysis.

Ubers Threatlist so far:

Spoiler

Aegislash:
Amoonguss:
Arceus:

Spoiler

Arceus
Arceus-Bug:
Arceus-Dark:
Arceus-Dragon:
Arceus-Electric:
Arceus-Fairy:
Arceus-Fighting:
Arceus-Fire:
Arceus-Flying:
Arceus-Ghost:
Arceus-Grass:
Arceus-Ground:
Arceus-Ice:
Arceus-Poison:
Arceus-Psychic:
Arceus-Rock:
Arceus-Steel:
Arceus-Water:

Spoiler

Blaziken:
Blissey:
Bronzong:
Chansey:
Charizard:
Clefable:
Darkrai:
Deoxys-A:
Deoxys-D:
Deoxys-S:
Dialga:
Ditto:
Ferrothorn:
Forretress:
Garchomp:
Gastrodon:
Genesect:
Gengar:
Giratina:
Giratina-O:
Gliscor:
Groudon:
Gyarados:
Heatran:
Hippowdon:
Ho-Oh:
Jirachi:
Kangaskhan:
Klefki:
Kyogre:
Kyurem-W:
Landorus-T:
Lucario:
Lugia:
Mewtwo:
Mewtwo-X:
Mewtwo-Y:
Palkia:
Rayquaza:
Reshiram:
Scizor:
Scolipede:
Shaymin-S:
Skarmory:
Smeargle:
Sylveon:
Terrakion:
Thundurus:
Tyranitar
Wobbuffet:
Xatu:
Xerneas:
Yveltal:
Zekrom:
[/hide]

OU Threatlist so far:

Spoiler

Abomasnow:
Aegislash:
Aggron:
Alakazam:
Amoonguss:
Azumarill:
Bisharp:
Blastoise:
Blissey:
Breloom:
Celebi:
Chansey:
Charizard X:
Charizard Y:
Chesnaught:
Clefable:
Cloyster:
Conkeldurr:
Crobat:
Deoxys-D:
Deoxys-S:
Diggersby:
Ditto:
Donphan:
Dragonite:
Espeon:
Excadrill:
Ferrothorn:
Forretress:
Galvantula:
Garchomp:
Gardevoir:
Gastrodon:
Genesect:
Gengar:
Gliscor:
Goodra:
Greninja:
Gyarados:
Haxorus:
Heatran:
Heracross:
Hippowdon:
Hydreigon:
Infernape:
Jellicent:
Jirachi:
Jolteon:
Keldeo:
Kingdra:
Klefki:
Kyurem-B:
Landorus:
Landorus-T:
Latias:
Latios:
Lucario:
Magnezone:
Mamoswine:
Manaphy:
Mandibuzz:
Mawile:
Medicham:
Metagross:
Mew:
Ninetales:
Noivern:
Politoed:
Pinsir:
Porygon2:
Quagsire:
Reuniclus:
Rotom-H
Rotom-W:
Sableye:
Salamence:
Scizor:
Scolipede:
Skarmory:
Slowbro:
Slowking:
Smeargle:
Starmie:
Sylveon:
Talonflame:
Tentacruel:
Terrakion:
Thundurus:
Thundurus-T:
Togekiss:
Tornadus:
Tornadus-T:
Trevenant:
Tyranitar:
Vaporeon:
Venusaur:
Victini:
Volcarona:
Weavile:
Zapdos:
Zygarde:
[/HIDE]

Thanks finch and karppu (gave me a separate ou threatlist) for cleaning up the ou threatlist! Ones that I don't think should be in the OU Threatlist as well:
Staraptor , Suicune, Roserade, Dugtrio

Discuss whether these pokemon that should be in the threatlist. Feel free to throw in others as well, but make sure you have the necessary justification why it should be in the threatlist.

Edit: Done some of the pictures for XY UU

 

Following a pm from DracoNinja, I have added movesets to the threat list. You can see the result here: http://pastebin.com/gNnKQCav. We will also split the list into offensive and defensive threats, so that's why every set has an O or D next to it. A few remarks:

- I don't know what sets some Pokemon run, so I have left some Pokemon open.
- Do we really need all the Arceus formes? Steel probably deserves a set, Fighting and Poison are on the edge...and what are all the others even supposed to do?
- We might split off the niche threats into a separate list. In that case I think we should put the following Pokemon there:

Amoonguss (?), Bronzong, Charizard, Deoxys-D (or remove altogether), Ditto, Forretress, Garchomp, Gastrodon (?), Gyarados, Heatran (?), Klefki, Lucario, Skarmory, Wobbuffet, Xatu.

- If you have any remarks, additions or corrections, please comment!

EDIT: Updated list, thx Poli.

 

Updated Ubers List, I'll get around finishing the rest when I'm not lazy busy

 

Made a XY LC Threat list:

Spoiler

Abra:
Amaura:
Anorith:
Archen:
Axew:
Bagon:
Bellsprout:
Bronzor:
Bulbasaur:
Bunnelby:
Carvanha:
Chimchar
Chinchou:
Clamperl:
Cottonee:
Corphish:
Cranidos:
Croagunk:
Cubone:
Darumaka:
Deino:
Diglett:
Doduo:
Dratini:
Drifloon:
Drilbur:
Dwebble:
Elekid:
Exeggcute:
Ferroseed:
Fletchling:
Foongus:
Frillish:
Froakie:
Gastly:
Grimer:
Gothita:
Hippopotas:
Honedge:
Horsea:
Houndour:
Inkay:
Joltik:
Kabuto:
Koffing:
Larvesta:
Larvitar:
Lickitung:
Lileep:
Machop:
Magby:
Magnemite:
Mankey:
Mantyke:
Meditite:
Meowth:
Mienfoo:
Misdreavus:
Munchlax:
Murkrow:
Natu:
Oddish:
Omanyte:
Onix:
Pancham:
Pawniard:
Phantump:
Ponyta:
Porygon:
Pumpkaboo:
Purrloin:
Riolu:
Rufflet:
Scraggy:
Shellder:
Shelmet:
Skrelp:
Slowpoke:
Snover:
Snubbull:
Spinarak:
Solosis:
Spritzee:
Staryu:
Stunky:
Surskit:
Swirlix:
Taillow:
Teddiursa:
Tentacool:
Torchic:
Timburr:
Tirtouga:
Tyrunt:
Vullaby:
Vulpix:
Wynaut:
Zigzagoon:

 

Added, thanks!

 

Gothitelle needs to be added to XY Ubers [It traps and sets up on arceus forms - good players do use it, I've seen it in SPL and suchlike]

 

i was gonna use this for my own RMT and to make it pretty i added all the sprites
didnt find zard x but ok
but yeah here you go

Spoiler

Abomasnow:


Aegislash:


Aggron:


Alakazam:


Amoonguss:

Azumarill:

Bisharp:

Blastoise:

Blissey:

Breloom:

Celebi:

Chansey:

Charizard X:

Charizard Y:

Chesnaught:

Clefable:

Cloyster:

Conkeldurr:

Crobat:

Deoxys-D:

Deoxys-S:

Diggersby:

Ditto:

Donphan:

Dragonite:

Espeon:

Excadrill:

Ferrothorn:

Forretress:

Galvantula:

Garchomp:

Gardevoir:

Gastrodon:

Genesect:

Gengar:

Gliscor:

Goodra:

Greninja:

Gyarados:

Haxorus:

Heatran:

Heracross:

Hippowdon:

Hydreigon:

Infernape:

Jellicent:

Jirachi:

Jolteon:

Keldeo:

Kingdra:

Klefki:

Kyurem-B:

Landorus:

Landorus-T:

Latias:

Latios:

Lucario:

Magnezone:

Mamoswine:

Manaphy:

Mandibuzz:

Mawile:

Medicham:

Metagross:

Mew:

Ninetales:

Noivern:

Politoed:

Pinsir:

Porygon2:

Quagsire:

Reuniclus:

Rotom-H

Rotom-W:

Sableye:

Salamence:

Scizor:

Scolipede:

Skarmory:

Slowbro:

Slowking:

Smeargle:

Starmie:

Sylveon:

Talonflame:

Tentacruel:

Terrakion:

Thundurus:

Thundurus-T:

Togekiss:

Tornadus:

Tornadus-T:

Trevenant:

Tyranitar:

Vaporeon:

Venusaur:

Victini:

Volcarona:

Weavile:

Zapdos:

Zygarde:

 

Politoed/Pinsir/Tornadus/Trevenant have the wrong sprites @MetalGross

 

Thanks for pointing that out, fixed it.

 

^Hydreigon has Hippowdons sprite :3

 

thanks metalgross!

finished UU too yay!

I need somebody to do LU and NU (coming out tomorrow double yay!) for me too.

 

I was told to bump by someone, but w/e right? May as well add content! From what I've seen, the most prominent threats in NU are the weather abusers, most specifically Ludicolo. In the rain he can be an absolute beast with very solid coverage in Giga Drain, Ice Beam, and Hydro Pump. There's also the massive wall Cresselia, which with Moon blast and Psyshock could actually be a very potent offensive set. I'll attempt to come up with more NU threats later.

Also, yay, post #500 on a contributory note~

 

XY, where legit legendaries which only suffer from mediocre typing are NU (seriously that's all that's wrong with cress), heck we have auto-summon weather + swift swim sweepers. At this rate we need an NEU again probably lol.. this gen is weird.


.. and smogon have banned weather summoning from UU, ofc.

 

Spoiler

Abomasnow-M:
Aerodactyl-M:
Alomomola:
Amoonguss:
Ampharos-M:
Aromatisse:
Avalugg:
Azelf:
Banette-M:
Bronzong:
Celebi:
Chesnaught:
Cloyster:
Cobalion:
Cofagrigus:
Cresselia:
Deoxys-D:
Dragalge:
Druddigon:
Durant:
Emboar:
Entei:
Escavalier:
Exploud:
Feraligatr:
Flygon:
Froslass:
Gallade:
Gligar:
Golurk:
Goodra:
Gorebyss:
Gourgeist-XL:
Granbull:
Heliolisk:
Hippowdon:
Hitmonchan:
Hitmonlee:
Hitmontop:
Houndoom-M:
Jellicent:
Kabutops:
Krookodile:
Kyurem:
Ludicolo:
Machamp:
Magnezone:
Malamar:
Meloetta:
Mismagius:
Moltres:
Nidoqueen:
Ninetales:
Noivern:
Politoed:
Poliwrath:
Porygon2:
Porygon-Z:
Qwilfish:
Raikou:
Registeel:
Reuniclus:
Rotom-C:
Rotom-H:
Sableye:
Sawk:
Scrafty:
Sharpedo:
Shaymin:
Sigilyph:
Slowking:
Slurpuff:
Smeargle:
Snorlax:
Steelix:
Swampert:
Tangrowth:
Tentacruel:
Tornadus:
Tornadus-T:
Toxicroak:
Trevenant:
Tyrantrum:
Uxie:
Vaporeon:
Venomoth:
Victreebel:
Virizion:
Weezing:
Whimsicott:
Xatu:
Yanmega:

This LU Threatlist is courtesy of @Karppu <3

 

Karppu's lazy Draco, so he asked me to look over and see things that are missing/might not be worth a spot.

(21:52) Celestial Phantom: k so first thing i see is that porygon2's image is a porygon. second i don't see ambipom and it might be worth a mention due to speed + moves + ability.
(21:57) Amaterasu: there isn't cinccino / dugtrio / jolteon either
(22:10) Amaterasu: more things that i didn't put to that list, Braviary and Primeape

Meh, out of those things, maybe Braviary + Ambipom are worth the mention. Primeape/Cinccino maybe, Jolt/Duggy are more situation or just outclassed in some regards (jolt via power issues). Don't see Zoroark on the list either, but then again it's not so much a big deal though very much still a threat. Other than that, I'm too tired to actually care beyond that right now.

 

Added Zoroark Braviary and Ambipom in LU Threatlist

@Daybreak by any chance can you make a NU Threatlist too, thanks :tongue:
(anyone can also make a nu threatlist too, i would be eternally grateful)

 

Special thanks to @Veteran Padgett, @Windblown, @Selena Gomez, and @EljayQuiz for helping me finish this quickly. Also sorry @DracoNinja for this taking so long.

Spoiler: NU Threat List

Ambipom:
Archeops:
Aromatisse:
Banette:
Braviary:
Bronzong:
Chesnaught:
Cinccino:
Clawitzer:
Claydol:
Cryogonal:
Delphox:
Drapion:
Druddigon:
Dugtrio:
TobyfantDurant:
Dusclops:
Dusknoir:
Emboar:
Exploud:
Feraligatr:
Ferroseed:
Fletchinder:
Froslass:
Gallade:
Gastrodon:
Golbat:
Golem:
Golurk:
Gorebyss:
Gourgeist-XL:
Granbull:
Hariyama:
Heliolisk:
Hippowdon:
Hitmonchan:
Hitmontop:
Jolteon:
Jynx:
Kabutops:
Klinklang:
Lanturn:
Lilligant:
Ludicolo:
Magmortar:
Magneton:
Mesprit:
Milotic:
Miltank:
Mismagius:
Moltres:
Natu:
Ninetales:
Ninjask:
Omastar:
Quagsire:
Qwilfish:
Registeel:
Rhydon:
Rotom:
Rotom-C:
Rotom-F:
Rotom-S:
Piloswine:
Politoed:
Poliwrath:
Porygon2:
Porygon-Z:
Primeape:
Samurott:
Sandslash:
Sawk:
Sceptile:
Scrafty:
Scyther:
Seismitoad:
Shiftry:
Shuckle:
Sigilyph:
Skuntank:
Slurpuff:
Spiritomb:
Steelix:
Stoutland:
Swampert:
Swellow:
Tangela:
Tauros:
Togetic:
Typhlosion:
Uxie:
Vaporeon:
Venomoth:
Victreebel:
Vileplume:
Vivillon:
Weezing:
Whimsicott:
Wobbuffet:
Yanmega:
Zangoose:
Zoroark:

 

np g8 work, anyone is free to nitpick any of the pokemon listed in any of the threat lists btw (just don't give shit)

 

Add dese mons:
Dragalge
muk
pyroar
gurdurr
avalugg
kecleon
accelgor
masquerain
regirock
electivire
bouff

 

Afro Smash I'll add in the pokemon you listed later, fixed new july/august tier shifts too! Feel free to post if I missed out anything!

 

There is a problem with the spoiler things. When I click them it says "There was a security error".

 

XY OU could receive an update; quite a lot of mons on the list are banned or irrelevant.

 

Its me or the links to all the prefix tags for the Team Archive forums in the OP post don't work? @Hikari

Also:

XY Ubers:
add Primal Groudon and Primal Kyogre

XY OU:
add Mega Sableye, Mega Diancie, Mega Gallade, Mega Altaria, Mega Lopunny, Mega Metagross
Mega Mawile, Greninja, Aegislash, Genesect and both Deoxys are banned to ubers now
take out Donphan, Jolteon and maybe Blastoise and put them in UU. Mawile to NU

XY UU:
add Mega Beedrill, Mega Pidgeot
Gothitelle and Zygarde are OU now

XY LU:
add Mega Sceptile, Mega Glalie and Gothorita
Krookodile is UU now

XY NU:
Venomoth and Slurpuff are LU now (slurpuff soon to be UU too)