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[Final] Pelipper

Discussion in 'Gen 5 NU Analyses' started by Spoovo The Pirate, Dec 19, 2012.

  1. Spoovo The Pirate

    Spoovo The Pirate Meep! Article Contributor Article Contributor

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    updated

    {{Header}}

    {{Tier|BW2 NU}}

    {{Overview|And here we have another one of Gen 3's obscure additions. If you scrape out the bottom of the NU barrel, this little guy will fall out. It'll stare at you blankly for a few moments, which will give you enough time to take a close look back, and see what it's made of.

    With sub par stats, and only a base 100 Defence worth mentioning, things don't start off too promising. A reasonable base 85 Special Attack is decent, but then the detail in Pelipper's typing comes in. Water/Flying is pretty cool defensively, resisting Fire, Water, Fighting, Steel and Bug, all of which are fairly common in NU, not to mention a nifty Ground immunity. As long as Pelipper can avoid an Electric attack, it can use his passable bulk to set up rain and activate its ability, Rain Dish. Not only that, Pelipper has the perfect movepool to abuse this ability with, essentially making it a slower, bulkier Swanna.

    If you like the concept of Swanna, but don't like how easily it dies, perhaps you could look to Pelipper for a replacement?}}

    {{Set|Rain Offensive|
    Pelipper @ Damp Rock / Life Orb
    Trait: Rain Dish
    EVs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 SAtk
    Modest nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
    - Rain Dance
    - Hydro Pump / Surf
    - Hurricane
    - Roost / Ice Beam / U-turn}}

    {{Comments|With near max HP investment, Rain Dish, Roost and possibly even Leftovers recovery all working in tandem, Pelipper can be fairly bulky under ideal conditions. And this set isn't just bulky either; it has a respectable 295 Special Attack to fire double boosted Hydro Pumps and perfectly accurate Hurricanes from, meaning it isn't setup fodder either.

    248 HP EVs are invested instead of 252 because this keeps Pelipper's HP odd, thus meaning it can switch more often into Stealth Rock if it has to. The Special Attack is then maxed out after that, and the remains are placed into Defence to bulk the pelican out as much as possible whilst retaining the ability to hit hard.

    Rain Dance is the primary move on this set, because without it, most of Pelipper's set would be crippled. Not only does it activate Rain Dish, but it also powers up its Water STAB, and ensures Hurricane's perfect accuracy. Without the rain, this set wouldn't function nearly as well. Those aforementioned STAB moves are listed in slots 2 and 3. Hydro Pump is vastly preferred over Surf, mostly because it helps Pelipper stick out from Swanna, who doesn't get it for some reason, but also because its base 85 Special Attack while usable, is far from impressive, and thus tends to need the power boost. If the accuracy scares you however, feel free to swap Hydro Pump out for Surf, or even Scald if the 30% burn rate appeals.

    Hurricane in slot 3 will never miss while it's raining, and also acts as a very powerful STAB that Pelipper can easily spam, occasionally inflicting confusion as well. Between Pelipper's two STAB moves, very little resists both, which is why the fourth slot is flexible, and can be tailored to Pelipper's - or the team's - needs. Roost is simply there to keep the pelican healthy, should Rain Dish not restore its HP fast enough for your liking. It also allows Pelipper to tank weaker Ice moves while it is Roosting, however this is an unlikely scenario. Ice Beam on the other hand stops Altaria, Mandibuzz and a couple other special walls from being too troublesome. It won't hit much harder than a simple STAB Hurricane (in Mandibuzz's case), but unlike Hurricane, it will always hit in any weather, and thus has reason to be considered. Lastly, U-turn's an option for simple scouting, again separating it from rival Swanna, but not hitting very hard coming from a hindered, uninvested, base 50 Attack stat. Damage may not be the goal for most U-turners, but be aware that Pelipper's Attack stat is awful.

    Lastly, the item choices. The Damp Rock is the main listed one on this set, as it allows the rain to last longer, meaning Pelipper lasts longer thanks to Rain Dish, and also that it can support the team more efficiently. The Life Orb however gives Pelipper's average Special Attack a much needed power boost in exchange for 10% HP per hit; which can be alleviated with Rain Dish. Lastly, the Leftovers aren't listed in the potential hold items, but they're more than viable on this set, given Pelipper's reasonable bulk. Feel free to give each item a try, and see which one works best for you.}}

    {{Set|Defensive|
    Pelipper @ Leftovers
    Trait: Rain Dish
    EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SDef
    Bold nature (+Def, -Atk)
    - Scald
    - Roost
    - Knock Off / Toxic
    - Air Slash / Toxic}}

    {{Comments|If going fully offensive with Pelipper doesn't appeal to you so much, perhaps a supporting set better suits your preferences?

    Pelipper's physical bulk is deceptively good, and this set capitalises on it, all but maxing it out. Like the previous set, the HP is kept odd to help Pelipper deal with Stealth Rock, while the remaining 8 EVs are placed into Special Defence this time, as Pelipper wants to take hits as well as possible. The Leftovers are the only given hold item on this set, for basically the same reason.

    Rain Dish remains Pelipper's listed ability, as it is far less useless than Keen Eye. While it won't do anything outside of rain, it does mean that Pelipper can take advantage of the rain whenever it does start to fall, gently recovering HP every turn.

    Scald is the primary attack for this set, being a respectably powerful move that also sports a 30% chance of burning whatever it hits, making Pelipper even harder for physical attackers to deal with. Roost in slot 2 keeps Pelipper healthy as always, and reliable recovery is what separates Pelipper from a lot of the tier's bulky Waters, with Quagsire being about the only other bulky Water in the tier that has reliable recovery.

    Slot 3 yields Knock Off, which is especially useful for removing the hold items of whatever switches into the move. It may deal little damage, but a lot of pokemon in NU are heavily reliant on Leftovers and Eviolite, meaning they'll be infinitely crippled should they lose their hold items. Air Slash in slot 4 is listed mostly because of the great neutral coverage it has with Scald, and also being another thing that separates Pelipper as a bulky Water. If you find yourself never using either Knock Off or Air Slash, either one of them can be swapped out for Toxic, as this helps Pelipper break down opposing walls like Alomomola.

    Other options on this set would include going specially defensive as a novelty means of beating Samurott, and employing specific Hidden Powers. As this Pelipper set functions more as a defensive pivot, Hidden Powers can be used for wearing down threats such as Mantine, and U-Turn is a viable (albeit weak) for scouting and gaining momentum. A Relaxed nature and 0 Speed IVs can be used if you employ U-Turn, because a slot switch is better in this case, as it gives the next pokemon a free switch in more often. Speaking of Speed, investing a few EVs to outrun other uninvested base 65s in the tier, such as Alomomola and Flareon, can be done if you feel your team needs that.}}

    {{Options|The two sets can combine to create a more defensive Rain setter if you deem it necessary, with Rain Dance, Roost, U-turn and either Scald or Hurricane in the last slot.

    Pelipper has access to Agility, which can be used to patch up its otherwise disappointing Speed stat. It tends to lack the power to sweep on its own though, so just boosting its Speed isn't recommended. A simple four attacks set can be done, featuring Hydro Pump, Air Slash, Ice Beam and one of Hurricane, U-turn or a random Hidden Power. Pelipper also learns Shock Wave for some inane reason, but aside from the move being illegal with Rain Dish, its only real use is having your opponents die of laughter from the mere sight of it. If you're insistent on Pelipper having an Electric move, make it Hidden Power Electric. It'll hit Mantine, Swanna, other Pelipper, and a couple of very specific targets like Carracosta. Note that Carracosta is hit harder by both Hydro Pump and Hidden Power Grass, however.

    Stockpile can be used to boost both of Pelipper's Defences at the same time, however the bird is very vulnerable to status, and likely won't be able to set itself up effectively. Lastly, don't consider any physical moves on Pelipper aside from U-turn. Its base 50 Attack simply is not worth it.}}

    {{Checks|Literally anything with an Electric move and a decent Speed stat threatens Pelipper if it can get in safely. This includes basically all of the tier's Electric-types aside from Eelektross and Stunfisk, Haunter, offensive Misdreavus and even Rapidash in a pinch. Offensive Pelipper sets will practically always use Rain Dance first turn, giving the opponent a perfect opportunity to switch in and hit it hard, but don't get complacent and assume it won't simply fire off a Hydro Pump beforehand, to try and catch its opponent off guard.

    Tough special walls like Regice and Mandibuzz can tank Pelipper's hits relatively well, and Regice can fire back a Thunderbolt to KO Pelipper without much trouble, however it will likely be outrun. Mandibuzz on the other hand can Taunt Pelipper to stop it from restoring its HP, and then either chip away at its HP with Toxic or smash away at it with repeated Brave Birds, all while Roosting off any damage. Mantine in particular gets a strong mention for either absorbing Pelipper's Water STABs or using its rain against it with Swift Swim, also tanking Hurricanes extremely well thanks to its amazing special bulk, outrunning, and firing back decently powerful Air Slashes.

    Grumpig can tank a hit or two, but is worn down easily, and while Cloud Nine Altaria stops Pelipper's rain from taking effect, it can't take an Ice Beam very well at all. Cloud Nine Golduck also deserves a mention for this reason, cancelling out Pelipper's weather with its ability and being able to set up Calm Minds on it while Pelipper is either forced out, or forced to try and hit it with an inaccurate Hurricane.

    While unconventional, Swift Swim Armaldo can use Pelipper's rain against it, outrunning and smacking the bird hard with a STAB Stone Edge. Armaldo can't switch in too safely though, being weak to Water and only neutral to Hurricane. Storm Drain Cradily is worthy of a mention too, tanking Hurricanes well enough, and absorbing Pelipper's Water STABs, which only power up its Giga Drains and prevent it from healing itself with Roost. Unless Pelipper gets lucky with confusion or carries Toxic, Storm Drain Cradily can shut it down pretty efficiently.

    Changing the weather to anything but rain can thwart Pelipper, but this tends to count as more of a bandage than an actual answer, because there would be little stopping Pelipper from simply using Rain Dance again on its next attempt.

    Pelipper may hit relatively hard, but it is far from difficult to stop, being fairly slow, and not that bulky. Literally anything with a Speed stat higher than 136 will outrun most sets, and after that all you'll need is a hard hitting STAB - preferably one that hits on the special side of the spectrum. The likes of Gardevoir easily outrun Pelipper, and can smite it with either a Psychic or a Thunderbolt for heavy damage, all the while outrunning and tanking a STAB hit well due to its good Special Defence.}}

    {{footer}}
     
    Last edited: May 24, 2015
  2. Incon

    Incon I feel incapable of seeing the end.

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    For the first set, Life Orb should be the first slash as it needs all the power it can get. Leftovers should be slashed last imo (or not at all). Mention that it likes Rapid Spin support but isn't dependent on it due to Roost. Say that electric types can switch in easily when Pelipper Roosts or Rain Dances forcing him out. Finally, Magmortar cannot be a check because it is LU. Oh, and remove Emboar mention. Very little run Wild Charge, let alone outspeed. Otherwise, the skeleton is pretty straightforward. You like them gimmicky mons, eh? lol
     
    Last edited: Dec 19, 2012
  3. Spoovo The Pirate

    Spoovo The Pirate Meep! Article Contributor Article Contributor

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    Lol, yup. I like almost all of them. Just wait til I do Luvdisc. ;D

    Forgot that Magmortar's LU. Any suggestions for more checks that aren't Electric types? Misdreavus uses Thunderbolt on occasion...
     
  4. Green Eyed Russian

    Green Eyed Russian Perish Song Sirens

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    I think you should mention Knock Off in Pelipper's second set, it helps him to deal with Leftovers and Eviolite Pokemon. Pretty sure most of them prefer to run this move instead of Stockpile because once statused, Pelipper defensive boosts won't really help him.
     
  5. Spoovo The Pirate

    Spoovo The Pirate Meep! Article Contributor Article Contributor

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    Stockpile's what makes the set though. Otherwise he doesn't take hits nearly as well.

    Knock Off is worth a mention, however. I'll see what the QC guys say as to where it goes exactly. :3
     
  6. Luck>Skill

    Luck>Skill Well-Known Member

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    Definitely run Knock Off over Stockpile, and move the SDef EVs to Def, Pelipper is a physical wall

    Remove any Protect mention, it just doesn't work, on the last wall slot the slashes should be:

    Hurricane / Toxic / Air Slash
     
  7. Spoovo The Pirate

    Spoovo The Pirate Meep! Article Contributor Article Contributor

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    So...

    Bold @ Leftovers
    248 HP, 252 Def, 8 SDef

    -Knock Off
    -Roost
    -Scald / Toxic
    -Hurricane / Air Slash / Toxic

    But this set's not relying on rain, though. Should I leave Hurricane out?
     
  8. Luck>Skill

    Luck>Skill Well-Known Member

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    Hurricane hits with 180, opposed to Air Slash' 112.5, and has a chance to confuse the opp, it's upon preference though
     
  9. Spoovo The Pirate

    Spoovo The Pirate Meep! Article Contributor Article Contributor

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    That's true, but on a defensive set, I wouldn't risk having a move miss 30% of the time.

    Still kinda confused on why you want Stockpile out. It's the selling point of the set imo.
     
  10. Dr. Fuji

    Dr. Fuji Active Member

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    Stockpile doesn't work on Pelipper because of how status weak it is it cannot stay in and slowly whittle pokemon's hp when it cannot take a toxic back not to mention its typing really does give it far more physical switch ins then special so it is preferable to have higher defense off of the bat. Stockpile and cosmic power to an extent don't work on most pokemon and the ones it does work on have methods for being offensive or do not mind status think clefable, sigilyph, arceus steel and other like minded pokemon.
     
  11. emac

    emac Emad

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    Yeah, no stockpile. Specially defensive pelipper is actually a pretty cool samurott check. Maybe that could be mentioned somewhere. Also, mention that swanna pretty much outclasses the offensive set.
     
  12. Spoovo The Pirate

    Spoovo The Pirate Meep! Article Contributor Article Contributor

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    I reckon Pelipper's better bulk gives him a reason to be used instead of Swanna, but I see your point.

    I'll get rid of Stockpile. Much as I like it, you guys don't, lol.

    EDIT: Made changes to the defensive set. How's it all looking now?
     
    Last edited: Dec 20, 2012
  13. Dr. Fuji

    Dr. Fuji Active Member

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    Defensive set looks pretty much perfect to me the only possible change I would make to that set is to use some weird coverage hp or U-Turn but that's team specific and not needed to be mentioned anywhere but OO looks great.
     
  14. Spoovo The Pirate

    Spoovo The Pirate Meep! Article Contributor Article Contributor

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    I'll mention random HPs and U-Turn in the set discussion. ^-^
     
  15. The Real Elmo

    The Real Elmo Caterpie hungers...

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    I don't see anything wrong with this ^_^
    approved
     
  16. Dzi

    Dzi So Nyuh Shi Dae

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    Approved.
     
  17. Incon

    Incon I feel incapable of seeing the end.

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    ... and the third one - Approved.