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[WIP] Starmie

Discussion in 'OU Analyses' started by Spoovo The Pirate, Sep 4, 2016.

  1. Spoovo The Pirate

    Spoovo The Pirate Meep! Article Contributor Article Contributor

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    Just a skeleton for now, because watching anime.

    [​IMG]

    This little star is the fastest water-type outside of Ubers, thanks to Greninja's banning. It boasts solid Water/Psychic typing, with a good attacking movepool, which makes it a very flexible pokemon to work with, often fulfilling several team roles at once.

    With access to both Recover and Natural Cure, Starmie has no trouble surviving until late game, just as long as its many weaknesses don't get the better of it. Being vulnerable to Knock Off, Volt Switch AND U-turn- i.e. the trilogy of irritation - can make this more difficult, however.

    The biggest feather in Starmie's cap, however (yes, starfish can wear hats), is that it gets Rapid Spin. Its longevity and ability to safely remove entry hazards allows it to really annoy stall teams, at least once their Ghost-type has been removed.

    All in all, it can be difficult to use well, but it's been the star of OU since its inception in gen 1. Perhaps there's a reason for that.

    == Bulky Spinner ==

    Starmie @ Leftovers
    Trait: Natural Cure
    EVs: 248 HP / 8 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Timid nature (+Spd, -Atk)

    - Rapid Spin
    - Recover
    - Scald
    - Psyshock / Ice Beam / Reflect Type

    This set capitalises on Starmie's great Speed and acceptable bulk to irritate stall teams. Recover and Natural Cure give it lots of longevity, which allows it to keep coming in and keep spinning.

    Rapid Spin is of course obligatory, for removing entry hazards. Scald's burn rate is very useful, and can cripple physical attackers.

    Lastly, slot 4 has a few options to keep things interesting. Psyshock breaks into special walls like Blissey much more effectively than Psychic would, however it is slightly less powerful. Ice Beam on the other hand stops Dragons like Dragonite and Latias from setting up on it. Reflect Type comes in useful for messing with opponents and playing mindgames, such as Reflecting a Ferrothorn's type to effectively render Starmie immune to it.

    == Offensive ==

    Starmie @ Life Orb
    Trait: Natural Cure / Analytic
    EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
    Timid nature

    - Scald / Hydro Pump
    - Psyshock / Psychic
    - Ice Beam
    - Thunderbolt / Rapid Spin

    Armed with a Life Orb and full Special Attack investment, this set hits much harder than the previous set, meaning Starmie can act as a brilliant late game cleaner. On the flip side, it has far less bulk, but that shouldn't make a difference once checks and counters have been removed.

    Scald is once again the primary Water STAB, however Hydro Pump's increased power is also worth considering. Psyshock returns, but Psychic gets a backslash this time because of its increased power.

    Ice Beam is mainly for Dragons, but bulky Grass-types like Serperior also hate it. Lastly, Thunderbolt completes the coverage, hitting bulky Waters like Gyarados and Azumarill for better damage than Starmie can muster with anything else. They aren't as common nowadays though, so if you don't need Starmie to check them, it can still use Rapid Spin effectively. Note that Rapid Spin still incurs Life Orb recoil, however.

    Both Natural Cure and Analytic are mentioned as possible abilities for this set, as both are viable. Natural Cure means it can absorb status and hit hard, while Analytic provides a power boost if Starmie moves after its opponent. Note Starmie's high Speed contradicts this, but it also works if Starmie hits an opponent on the switch, because they essentially 'moved' before Starmie could attack.

    == Other Options ==

    Natural Cure means that Starmie can use Rest free of charge, just as long as it switches out after using it. Toxic is a viable means of wearing down bulky opponents like Slowbro and Latias, because even with recovery, they will lose HP much faster when poisoned.

    Starmie gets Rain Dance, which can combine with a Water STAB and Thunder for some serious damage. The hold item can be either a Damp Rock or a Life Orb, depending on whether Starmie wants to support with the rain, or attack independently.

    Hidden Power Fire is useful for the likes of Scizor and Ferrothorn, who would otherwise threaten Starmie greatly. Grass Knot, Dazzling Gleam and Signal Beam all have their uses in battle, with the likes of Swampert, Umbreon and Celebi being hit harder than Starmie's common move choices. Surf has more accuracy than Hydro Pump, and more power than Scald, making it an ideal compromise if you're just looking for reliability. Icy Wind can slow down targets, and neuter slower Choice Scarfed opponents.

    Lastly, Starmie can use the Choice Scarf or even Specs itself. Consider Trick if you're tempted by Choiced Starmie.

    == Checks and Counters ==

    Bulky Grass-types can win if they can avoid Ice Beam. Ferrothorn fears only Hidden Power Fire - which is rare - and can smack Starmie around with Power Whip. The likes of Specially Defensive Celebi and Assault Vest Tangrowth also fare well as initial switch ins, if not straight up answers.

    Latios and Latias can Calm Mind up on Starmie with ease as long as it lacks Ice Beam, and then dispose of it with Dragon Pulse or perhaps even Thunderbolt.

    Bulky Waters like Suicune can tank anything except for a boosted Thunderbolt well enough, and then set up Calm Minds. Defensive Seismitoad fears only the rare Grass Knot, and can wear Starmie down with Earthquakes and perhaps Toxic. Be prepared for a long battle if Starmie has Recover.

    Standard special walls like Chansey and Sylveon don't like Psyshock much, but otherwise stop Starmie in its tracks. They won't stop it from spinning however. Gengar and other Ghost-types can switch in on Rapid Spin, and then KO Starmie with Shadow Ball. Jellicent is about the only one that can come in repeatedly though.

    Lastly, rarities like Lanturn and Jynx are practically full stops to Starmie, however justifying a use for them in OU can be difficult.
     
    Last edited: Sep 10, 2016
  2. Joyverse

    Joyverse Back for a blast!

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    I think most of it checks out though I have few nitpicks.
    1)Slash reflect type on bulky spinner's 4th slot.
    2)Change offensive's ability to analytic.
    3)ew to flash can and gem! XV
    I'll touch upon the rest later. And quit overworking yourself lmao!
     
    Last edited: Sep 5, 2016
  3. Spoovo The Pirate

    Spoovo The Pirate Meep! Article Contributor Article Contributor

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    Overworking? These took about ten minutes each lol.

    I'll get those done. Didn't think Power Gem would have much merit, and I guess Flash Cannon doesn't cover anything that the rest of its movepool does huh?
     
  4. Joyverse

    Joyverse Back for a blast!

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    Yes, it doesn't lmao.
    Also idk about Jynx and Lanturn, no one uses them in OU. No one uses water absorb quaggy as well xd.
     
  5. Spoovo The Pirate

    Spoovo The Pirate Meep! Article Contributor Article Contributor

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    I can change him out for defensive Seismitoad if that appeals? Still rare, but I figure something like that needs to be mentioned.
     
  6. LittleRoot

    LittleRoot Active Member

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    Toxic is worth mentioning in bulky set, helps to wear down fat things like slowbro, volcanion, garchomp, landorus; which are pretty much comman nowdays also toxicing latis are not that bad (LO+Toxic).
     
  7. Spoovo The Pirate

    Spoovo The Pirate Meep! Article Contributor Article Contributor

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    Drag, you always seem to assume a perfect scenario when damage calc...ing. SR damage neuters that prediction, as well as the assumption that it's Starmie switching into Dragonite, not the vice versa. If Dragonite's already setup, Starmie can't really do much, hence 'prevents', by hitting and breaking Multiscale on the switch in, and then Ice Beaming next turn.
     
    Joyverse and prof.dragonite like this.
  8. Joyverse

    Joyverse Back for a blast!

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    You can probably mention SpDef Celebi and AssVest Tangrowth both are probably worth getting a mention.

    NO!

    That's called being dumb. I pretty told you on this subject once lmao.
     
  9. Spoovo The Pirate

    Spoovo The Pirate Meep! Article Contributor Article Contributor

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    Heh, you're that much against the Ring Target gimmick huh?

    Surprised on AssVest though. I'll get those tweaked out.
     
  10. Joyverse

    Joyverse Back for a blast!

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    About AV Starmie tho, that's just me not liking it. If anyone else has used it to the fullest on tours/ladders and know its workings then they are free to pitch in!
     
  11. Joyverse

    Joyverse Back for a blast!

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    CM Bro checks out. It's used and so is Suicune in OU (CroCune and SubCM) so that's fine. Also about CM Latios, it's used here as well lol. Did you not use any of the OU autoteams here?
     
  12. Spoovo The Pirate

    Spoovo The Pirate Meep! Article Contributor Article Contributor

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    It might surprise you, but there are competitive communities other than Smogon. Just because they don't have it listed, or use it often, doesn't mean we can't use it, or make it inviable.

    Hell, if anything, that's probably good reason to use it. xD
     
  13. Spoovo The Pirate

    Spoovo The Pirate Meep! Article Contributor Article Contributor

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    Well yeah, that's perfectly fair enough. Everyone starts somewhere.

    I just listed Suicune because it was the first one I thought of. Slowbro probably is a more appropriate choice, but they're both at least viable, so ehh... *shrugs*
     
  14. Annoying Orange

    Annoying Orange sweet creature Server Moderator Social Media Rep Server Moderator Social Media Rep

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    Physically bulky rotom loves this thing