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v 2.4.2


[UU] Darmanitan / Hihidaruma

Discussion in 'UU' started by Shawn Frost, Jan 15, 2011.

  1. Shawn Frost

    Shawn Frost Neko-sama

    Messages:
    501
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    Ability: Sheer Force (Encourage) / Daruma Mode
    Base Stats: 105 / 140 / 55 / 30 / 55 / 95
    Base Total: 480
    Weak To: (2x) Rock | Ground | Water
    Resists: (1/2) Bug | Fire | Grass | Ice | Steel​



    At first look, the thing that catches your eye is the base 140 Attack. Darmanitan's Normal Form has the highest base Attack of all Fire-type Pokémon. The other thin that catches your eagle eye is the 105 HP and 95 Speed.

    At Max EVs, its Attack can reach to a deadly 416. Give it a choice band, and you get a devastating 624 Attack. Lets look at its Speed. At Max EVs, he can reach 317 Speed. Not much compared with devastating pokemon like Aianto, who itself can reach 380+ Speed. But pat in a choice scarf, and you canr each over 480+ Speed. Epic eh? This can all look good on theorymon, but look closer and what do you see? The 55 Defense and Special Defense stand out as an eyesore compared to all those magical numbers. The problem? Anything that outspeeds this thing can kill it. Example? +2 Terakion who is the best of UU.

    Now lets look at its movepool.
    Tackle
    Rollout
    Devastate
    Rage
    Fire Fang
    Headbutt
    Swagger
    Facade
    Fire Punch
    Cheer Up
    Thrash
    Belly Drum
    Flare Blitz
    Hammer Arm
    Taunt
    Superpower
    Overheat
    Roar
    Toxic
    Bulk Up
    Hidden Power
    Sunny Day
    Taunt
    Hyper Beam
    Protect
    Frustration
    SolarBeam
    Knock Down
    Earthquake
    Return
    Dig
    Psychic
    Brick Break
    Double Team
    Flamethrower
    Fire Blast
    Rock Tomb
    Torment
    Facade
    Nitro Charge
    Rest
    Attract
    Thief
    Canon
    Overheat
    Focus Blast
    Fling
    Devastate
    Will-O-Wisp
    Payback
    Giga Impact
    Stone Edge
    Gyro Ball
    Smooth Over
    Rock Slide
    Cheer Up
    Grass Knot
    Swagger
    U-turn
    Substitute
    Rock Smash
    Strength[/HIDE]

    It has a great physical movepool. Check it out, it has Flare Blitz, Superpower, Rock Slide, Earthquake, U-Turn and Stone Edge. Also, you have probably noticed, it has Encourage. What is Encourage?It boosts the power of a move that has a secondary effect to 1.3x while cancelling its secondary effect. What do you get then? Rock Slide gets a power boost.

    One of the most viable sets for Darmanitan in UU is to run a choice band. It can become heavily powerful, taking down anything it outspeeds with Flare Blitz, even those that resists it.

    Hihidaruma @ Choice Band
    Trait: Encourage
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
    Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
    - Flare Blitz
    - Rock Slide / Stone Ede
    - Earthquake
    - Superpower[/HIDE]

    Also you might want to check out Staraptor. It has 120 base Attack, 20 Stat less than Darmanitan, but it makes up for that by having 100 base speed and close combat. Staraptor can also be counted as a faster version of Darmanitan, both have a stat deducting Fighting type move (Superpower / Close Combat), both have a STAB recoil move (Flare Blitz / Brave Bird). Staraptor also has an immunity to ground type moves.

    Lets discuss Darmanitan's impact, counters and sets in the UnderUsed metagame.
    Last edited: Jan 17, 2011
  2. Galblade

    Galblade FAT PRINCESS

    Messages:
    1,416
    Hihi can also run a LO set to feign CB/CS. I feel there are very few mons that can safely switch in to Hihi. Rugged helm + Rough skin Kurimugan is one of them though, but he is a very specialised counter I have been forced to run just to counter these suicide bombing pokemon.
  3. Jcpdragonx

    Jcpdragonx the business business

    Messages:
    796
    Darmanitan has a huge 140 stat and its counters are generally slower than it. The problem is that Pokemon like Milotic get 2HKOed (CB) on the switch. Sometimes you need to make a sac. It also gets the encourage boost. It also has U-turn to scout, which still hits hard. Its biggest problems are its Flare Blitz recoil and Steath Rock weakness. IMO, I think it is slightly too strong for UU.
    Last edited: Jan 17, 2011
  4. Galblade

    Galblade FAT PRINCESS

    Messages:
    1,416
    Pretty much what Jcp said. I did have Hihi in the starting suspects, maybe he'll have a suspect thread that will last longer than a day when this first round of suspects are done.
  5. pokemonnerd

    pokemonnerd No one listens to pnerd. Forum Moderator

    Messages:
    2,307
    I've found Rhyperior to be a hard counter to any Hihidaruma. With investment in HP and defense(you don't have to go 252/252), Solid Rock makes Superpower do less than half, and EQ does even less. Meanwhile, you can just sub up on the switch or waste it with EQ, depending on your set. I really haven't found much else, though, due to people not using it much(when I ladder, anyway) and the fact that Rhy has been on all 3 of my teams...
  6. Galblade

    Galblade FAT PRINCESS

    Messages:
    1,416
    I've been using Hihi in my Sun team to help "get some more evidence", This set is really trollful:

    Hihidaruma (M) @ Life Orb
    Trait: Encourage
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
    Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
    - Flare Blitz
    - Rock Slide
    - Earthquake
    - Bulk Up

    Bulk up on the obvious switch to whatever counter they have. then hit whatever it is hard.
  7. Aurist

    Aurist SIX walls. NO synergy.

    Messages:
    2,170
    just a minor nitpick here, Stone Edge doesn't get Encourage boost as critical hit ratio isn't counted for 'secondary effect'. Encourage works for the same moves that Serene Grace does.
  8. Contest Master Majin

    Contest Master Majin New Member

    Messages:
    266
    Darmanitan can run an extremely effective Nitro Charge set. Come in on one of the hundreds of Pokemon he can force out, Nitro Charge, sweep. To run it, you need to get rid of things such as Scarf Terakion and Latias, but all in all it's one of his best sets.
    Not even the mighty Gligar can counter Darmanitan that well, although it does a good job if it doesn't switch in (it takes around 55% from Flare Blitz and can Roost off damage so that it just ends up killing itself).
  9. Galblade

    Galblade FAT PRINCESS

    Messages:
    1,416
    Nitro Charge doesn't work with Encourage. All positive effects are removed when the pokemon has encourage as an ability. Gligar switching in to 55% damage is a dead Gligar. Hihi is faster, so he outspeeds and KOs it the second turn...

    Edit: What I mean is, if Gligar is coming in as a revenge killer, Hihi has done his job :D
  10. Wavy

    Wavy wow

    Messages:
    374
    Fortunately, Mamanbou can take just about anything this guy tries to dish out, barring sun being up. Still not 2HKO'd by +1, Life Orb, Encourage, Max ATK Adamant Flare Blitz.

    This thing would probably make me real mad if Mamanbou didn't end up in basically all my teams.

    here's Bulk Up Hihi versus Mamanbou.

    I tested with Flare Blitz the first time. This was the first of about 4 or 5 but they all went basically the same way.
    [secret]
    Sunstorm 2 sent out Edge! (Crobat)
    Sunstorm test sent out Hihidaruma!

    Start of turn 1
    Sunstorm 2 called Edge back!
    Sunstorm 2 sent out Cascade! (Mamanbou)

    Hihidaruma used Bulk Up!
    Hihidaruma's Attack rose!
    Hihidaruma's Defense rose!

    Start of turn 2
    Hihidaruma used Flare Blitz!
    It's not very effective...
    The foe's Cascade lost 47% of its health!
    Hihidaruma is hit with recoil!

    The foe's Cascade used Toxic!
    Hihidaruma was poisoned!

    Hihidaruma is hurt by poison!
    The foe's Cascade restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

    Start of turn 3
    Hihidaruma used Flare Blitz!
    It's not very effective...
    The foe's Cascade lost 44% of its health!
    Hihidaruma is hit with recoil!

    The foe's Cascade used Wish!

    Hihidaruma is hurt by poison!
    The foe's Cascade restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

    Start of turn 4
    The foe's Cascade used Protect!
    The foe's Cascade protected itself!

    Hihidaruma used Bulk Up!
    Hihidaruma's Attack rose!
    Hihidaruma's Defense rose!

    Cascade's wish came true!
    Hihidaruma is hurt by poison!
    The foe's Cascade restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

    Start of turn 5
    The foe's Cascade used Protect!
    The foe's Cascade protected itself!

    Hihidaruma used Earthquake!
    The foe's Cascade protected itself!

    Hihidaruma is hurt by poison!
    Hihidaruma fainted!
    The foe's Cascade restored a little HP using its Leftovers!
    [/secret]

    I also tested out a handful of scenarios (using bulk up extra times, using a different move, etc). Worst case scenario was Toxic missing and both of them dying because I had to re-apply it. And Bulk Up is by far the most threatening set to Mamanbou. I also always played with perfect prediction on part of the Hihidaruma player.

    So, yeah, if Hihi is giving you a hard time, go for Mamanbou.
  11. Galblade

    Galblade FAT PRINCESS

    Messages:
    1,416
    I've started using Mamanbou, but BU Hihi is still really good. Take out their Mamanbou (who I may add is a good wish passer), and your Hihi is good.

    Sure having a physically bulky water isn't really a specialised counter, but Hihi still tears teams apart.
  12. Wavy

    Wavy wow

    Messages:
    374
    Yeah. That's generally how counters work. Once I see hihi, basically I know that Mamanbou can't die or go <60% at any cost or I'm gonna be taking some serious damage. BU hihi isn't very hard to revenge kill fortunately, as he's not that fast without scarf.
  13. Groudon Ramsay

    Groudon Ramsay Active Member

    Messages:
    1,705
    People seem to be forgetting that Slowbro, Rhyperior, and Omastar still exist =/ Obviously they aren't hard counters (due to U-turn and Earthquake/Superpower), but at the very least they check Hihidaruma very effectively. Honestly, in the Sun, it was stupid scary, as it could OHKO even Latias with Flare Blitz, but now, its nowhere near as scary. Like honestly, remember Gen 4 Salamence and how it died to residual damage really fast? Hihidaruma dies to it even faster.
  14. Galblade

    Galblade FAT PRINCESS

    Messages:
    1,416
    Just a question, why was Staraptor declared BL last gen? It did the exact same thing Hihi does this gen.
  15. Erebos

    Erebos Banned

    Messages:
    745
    I can't take this thread seriously when the one writing it has choice band instead of LO as the powerhouse set. If you don't run LO or scarf, don't run hihi.
  16. Stofil

    Stofil Hello Miss Galaxy

    Messages:
    1,155
    LO won't net you the 2HKO against Suicune and friends with rocks up though.
  17. Galblade

    Galblade FAT PRINCESS

    Messages:
    1,416
    I use LO on my BU set, Its great.
  18. Groudon Ramsay

    Groudon Ramsay Active Member

    Messages:
    1,705
    SubRoost + Brave Bird + Close Combat was the set that got Staraptor sent to BL last Gen. That's irrelevant though, as this is a completely different Gen.
  19. Galblade

    Galblade FAT PRINCESS

    Messages:
    1,416
    Oooh, Sub roost. Thats cool.
  20. Lemon

    Lemon New Member

    Messages:
    25
    Hihi can not be removed from UU until latios does because personally i think a specs latias/ scarf latias hell even a LO latias is way cheaper than Hihi seeing latias survives any of his attacks and hits back with a OHKO (any move) also can a former Uber really be UU? but anyway thats for another thread... :)
  21. Galblade

    Galblade FAT PRINCESS

    Messages:
    1,416
    This isn't a suspect thread mate, its only discussing sets/counters ;)
  22. Lemon

    Lemon New Member

    Messages:
    25
    Well lmao sorry lol. I thought it was.. *disappears to the correct thread*
  23. Contest Master Majin

    Contest Master Majin New Member

    Messages:
    266
    I find the truly threatening set to be Choice Band. Unlike other generic Banders, it's nigh-impossible to work around because of the sheer power of Adamant Flare Blitz. The only thing that isn't at least 2HKOd is Bold Milotic with Marvel Scale activated...
    If people start using it it might be necessary to pack an Arcanine.
  24. Galblade

    Galblade FAT PRINCESS

    Messages:
    1,416
    Rough skin + rugged helmet Kuri is a great counter/check to Hihi. If it uses Flare Blitz/U-turn its taking massive recoil, and couple that with SR, it won't be switching in many times at all.

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